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safe soft foods for mommy?

Discussion in 'Birds - all breeds / types' started by ilovemycockatiels, Jan 21, 2005.



  1. ilovemycockatiels

    ilovemycockatiels New Member

    My female just laid an egg, I'm not sure that it is fertile but I want to provide her with soft foods. I gave her some hard boiled egg yolk yesterday but what else can I give her that is safe??
     
  2. charmedagain

    charmedagain New Member

    Hi is there a male in the cage with her if so chaces of the egg being fertile is high.

    What i feed mine is as follows.
    I boiled eggs and i mash this up with the shell aswell the whole egg is safe for the birds the shell gives extra calcium.
    Boiled pasta.
    Boiled Brown rice
    Wholewheat bread.
    I also give them EMP or CeDe which is a food that is design to hand feed and wean chicks you can buy this from any good petstore it has all the vitamins minerals and calcuim in it that the mother and growing chicks need i place this is a seperate dish and leave it for them to eat when they want it.

    Make sure the have a cuttlefish bone and mineral block in her cage at all times.
    Has she laid the egg in a nest box or the cage floor.
    If a cage floor the chances of them hatching is slim to none as the birds can not incubate the eggs correctly as they can not turn them properly and they do not stay warm for long.

    Cockatiels lay 1 egg every other day with the normal clutch being between 4-6eggs.
    Incubation period is 21days..

    Mike
     
  3. ilovemycockatiels

    ilovemycockatiels New Member

    There is a male in the cage, isn't he supposed to feed her through the hole of the nesting box? She chases him to the other end of the cage whenever he puts his face near the hole. She does come out to eat on her own though.

    So I can feed them just plain cooked egg noodles? What about veggies? What ones are safe for them? Would it be okay to give them jarred baby food as long as it has no milk? When I feed them the noodles or egg do I mix it with their normal diet or in a seperate dish?

    She did lay the egg in a nesting box. So if she layed this egg night before last, should I expect another egg either tonight or tommorrow sometime?

    Should I candle the egg(s) in 5 days from them being laid? What's safe that I can mark the eggs with to keep track of hatching dates? I don't want to hurt the babies.
     
  4. charmedagain

    charmedagain New Member

    Hi most female birds become aggressive when laying eggs and most will not allow the male into or next top the nest box until she has laid 2-3 of her eggs..

    brocolli.
    Carrots.
    Spinach.
    Apples.
    Pears.
    Banana.

    Are some of the fruit and veggies i feed mine some birds will not eat them so do not worry if they will not touch them.

    Baby foods are not advisable to be given to birds as most contain milk and can cause problems as birds are lactose intolerant.
    I put the soft foods in a seperate dish to there seed atleast this way they are getting there seed if they just want that soft foods should be removed from the cage after 2-4hours to stop bacteria forming.

    Birds usually lay there eggs the same time every other day so lets say she laid an egg at 10am today then on sunday she would usually lay her egg at 10am this is not a general rule as they will lay when the egg is ready to come.

    I use a non toxic marker to mark my eggs with a number and i write it in a book with the date of when it was laid.
    Once i have candled the egg at 5-7days i also write in the book if it was fertile or not..

    She will not incubate the eggs until the 2nd or 3rd egg has been laid so give an extra couple of days to the date it was laid.
    Any infertile eggs should not be removed from the nest allow her to sit them as she will lay more eggs to replace the ones removed which can be fatal to her..


    Mike
     
  5. ilovemycockatiels

    ilovemycockatiels New Member

    My female acts like she is incubating the egg already but when I looked into the nesting box earlier she wasn't sitting on it, it was next to her. Could this mean she is trying to lay another? I don't know the exact time she laid the egg but I know it was sometime Wednesday night or Thursday morning. So she could be laying another. Wouldn't any marker clog the pores of the egg just as oil from our hands could? I guess you should know by experience so I'll probably candle the egg in a few days. Should I mark it now so I don't get it mixed up with another if she lays one tonight?
     
  6. ilovemycockatiels

    ilovemycockatiels New Member

    Before I give them broccoli, carrots, or spinich do I need to cook it?
     
  7. ilovemycockatiels

    ilovemycockatiels New Member

    I found a permanent marker that says non-toxic but it stinks pretty bad and I don't want the fumes to hurt or kill the babies. And won't a washable or water based marker wash off when the female wets her underside to keep her eggs moist?
     
  8. charmedagain

    charmedagain New Member

    Aslong as you only put a small number on the egg it will be fine you can also use a pencil but you must be really careful not to crack the egg.

    You can either cook the veggies or just wash them thoroughly and just hang them in the cage and usually they just start pecking at them once they realise its food there is no stopping them.
    I just washed them and place them in the cage.
    Cucumber is also great for them.

    When they are incubating they sit completely flat on the eggs with there wings spread slightly to the sides.
    The male usually sits on a morning while the female is out having something to eat and drink and stretching her wings and to poop and then she will go back in the nest with both male and female incubating during the night..

    Some females become so agressive during egg laying and incubation that they will attack the male and can make him bleed.
    This is a sign that she will not allow him to feed the chicks and this can put a strain on her if she has more than 2-4chicks to raise.

    Mike
     
  9. ilovemycockatiels

    ilovemycockatiels New Member

    Thanks for your help I ran out of questions. I'm sure I'll have more so I'll come back when I need some answers :D Thanks again.
     
  10. mchat

    mchat New Member

    I find that my birds also have a liking for snowpeas and snowpea sprouts. I have never seen my male feed the female while on the eggs they both take turns with the male sitting most of the day and the feamle sitting most of the night. I also sprinkle egg and biscuit over the seed, in its dried form.

    I am finding that whichever birds is not sitting really wants to get out of the cage for a bit of a roam or will attack any toys in the cage.

    My cockatiels have laid 5 eggs this time round and they are due to start hatching this sunday. I don't worry about candeling or marking the eggs as I wokr on the 19-21 day incubation period for the last egg laid and it upset my male too much if the eggs are handled.

    My female is handraised and handels interuptions well but the male is avairy raised and not so good at interuptions.

    Mel.
     
  11. charmedagain

    charmedagain New Member

    I wait 5days after the 3rd egg has been laid before candling my cockatiels eggs.

    Candling and marking the eggs do not upset the parents much aslong as your quick all breeders mark there eggs as cockatiels are knwon to lay a clutch and just before they hatch she lays another clutch of eggs so it is always best to mark the eggs.

    Birds should not be fed biscuts as tey contain sugar and fat.
    Crackers are good for them so are baby biscuts.

    The incubation period does not start until the 2nd or 3rd egg hatches incubation period is 18-21days from the 2nd or 3rd egg.

    incubation for budgies is 19days.
    Incubation period for finch's is 14days.

    As with all birds the first clutch can fail but this is not always the case an aggressive bird or a bird that attacks the female or her chicks or vice versa should not be bred from again and removed from the cage.

    Some male cockatiels have been known to attack the chicks when he is wanting to breed again if this happens remove the male and allow the female to carry on as normal you may have to help by handfeeding the chicks..

    Mike
     
  12. charmedagain

    charmedagain New Member

  13. ilovemycockatiels

    ilovemycockatiels New Member

    My female laid her 2nd egg yesterday around noon. Before she laid the 2nd one, I put 1 dot on the 1st egg then 2 dots on the 2nd instead of numbers. I bought a cockatiel handbook yesterday and I know you told me birds are lactose intolerant but this book says that during breeding season you can give them bread soaked in milk. The book is made by BARRON'S and written by Matthew M. Vriends. Anyways, my female doesn't seem to mind when I mark the eggs unless she is in the box. I haven't really tried to touch her or the eggs while she is in it. I'm too scared of getting bit because I am sure she would bite pretty hard. I have a quick question... Is celery or the leaves okay for cockatiels to eat. Is handfeeding a better way to start taming your babies or would you get the same results if you wait until they fledge? I really don't have the time to handfeed but if they will be easier to tame or better pets I will. Can you do a mixture of handfeeding and letting the mom do some. Like maybe handfeeding them 2-3 times every day and handling them for a little while but let the mom do the rest?
     
  14. mchat

    mchat New Member

    The egg and biscuit mix that I am talking about is one that can be brought from the pet shop in a mix and is helpful when rearing chicks on solid food. Both my sister and I have between us raised 5 cluthches and we have never had the female lay another clutch while breeding but then ours appear to be rather different than most cockatiels in that the fathers appear to be doing most of the work when it comes to raising and sitting on the eggs. My pair were incubating the eggs from the first one and are pretty dedecated parents (which is necessary as there are 5 eggs this time) and on regular occasions share the incubating at the same time splitting the eggs between them.

    I have also read and heard (from breeders) of the bread in milk but my birds are not really adventerous when it comes to eating new stuff and it needs to be kept fresh.
     
  15. charmedagain

    charmedagain New Member

    HI i got this information from a breeder friend of mine she has been breeding cockatiels and other birds for many years hope this helps a little i am still waiting on replies from my other breeder friends on other spects of the questions you have asked..


    That book by Matthew Vriends that you refer to was written in 1937 and since its last revision 16 years have passed. Basically this book is filled with very good information and I do have a copy of this book. But I'm afraid that some of the info is a bit outdated. Avian medicine and knowledge grows by leaps and bounds each year and there is a lot that has been learned even since 1989.

    I realize some of the people on this board say that birds are "lactose intolerant" but that term isn't correct since that would imply that the birds are normally able to process lactose. BUt that is true, our pet parrots cannot digest the milk sugars because they lack the digestive enzymes to do so. They can develop severe allergies to milk if they are given it frequently. One vet said that if you must give your bird a piece of unsweetened whole grain cereal that was sitting in milk to do so no more than once or twice a month. I got that from Bird Talk magazine although which issue exactly I cannot say. I have a stack 3 feet high and it could take me quite a while to find it.

    While it is true that some "good bacteria" found in some pellets and seed mixes do digest milk sugars (lactobacillus and bifidus), these bacteria tend to go after the more complex milk sugars leaving others undigestible. The milk can encourage the growth of harmful germs in the digestive tract and promote diarhhea.

    While you would likely not see an immediate adverse reaction in your bird, over time it can start to cause a problem. Personally I avoid all milk in anything I allow my birds to taste. I would advise avoiding any milk altogether, but you can research the facts and decide for yourself what is best for you and your bird in your situation.

    I recall finding a baby robin about 20 years ago when I was a teenager. I soaked bread in milk (who knows where I got that idea) and that baby had very messy diarrhea type droppings. Immediately I knew this couldn't go on, that something wasn't right. So I went to the library (didn't have a computer or the internet back then ) and got an old book on rehabbing wild birds. It said to soak dog food in water and feed the bird bits of food that way. So I would break the kibble into smaller pieces using a toothpick and the moistened kibble would stick to the toothpick and I'd feed the baby by dropping pieces into his mouth, pretty much sliding the toothpick horizontally and wiping the food against the beak making it fall into his mouth. I knew nothing about temperature or even the fact that using a toothpick could be very dangerous for the bird. Amazingly the bird survived and for many many years I always knew my robin out there in the trees. He had a distinct sound and because he escaped me before I had him fully weaned, he was the only adult robin out there that would beg for food from other adult robins. They were feeding him too. He lived that way for many years. That certainly says something about wild birds and how they band together to help each other survive, especially the healthy ones.

    Anyhow, I hope some of this helps

    Hope this infomormation is able to help you decide i will post more as and when i get it for you..

    Mike
     
  16. mchat

    mchat New Member

    I'm not sure if you are over looking at links but here is one of the links that I have found extremyl helpful in most problems that I have come across whit my cockatiels. It has a pretty friendly guide to breeding as well.
    www.cockatielsociety.org.au/articles

    Most of their tips should be helpful.

    Mel.
     
  17. charmedagain

    charmedagain New Member

    Take a look at the birds are lactose intolerant sticky that advice is given from breeders on a cockatiel site they have been breeding for many years and all say the same thing they all have had problems with milk they all have been told by avian vets.

    If you want to go and feed your bird milk then go ahead at your own risk.

    Once an infection in the crop or digestive tract it does not show itself until its too late to cure.

    Mike

    From Karen...
    I was thinking about the date of the book too, because not many people realize that a book more than 5 yrs old or so in the bird world is really outdated. If it is in print, people think it is "gospel". I hope you can convince this person not to do the milk bread thing.
     
  18. ilovemycockatiels

    ilovemycockatiels New Member

    I haven't given my birds the milk and bread because you advised me not to and I believe you. Also I don't even think my birds will eat it. I've given them cooked brown rice, pears, and baby oatmeal (the only ingredient is oat flour, no milk) and they haven't touched any of it. What is something thats soft you've given your birds that they love I might be able to try it. I just looked in my book and found where is says 1937. And that the last revision was in 1989. Thats old. Do you know of any really good books about breeding that you've read?

    I've raised baby starlings before. I've never actually had them grow up and fly away. The first time was because I used KAYTEE formula and it says for all baby birds but someone on a message board like this told me it is fo parrots but by that time they had died. I had 3 others last spring. I was given a recipe including mashed puppy food, applesauce, carrots, baby food and a few other things. I had them til they were fledglings then I got another and I think it might have had a disease that got to the other three because they started dying one-by-one. It's a fun experience, it'd be better if I succeeded though...

    I also have another question... Does the mother know if an egg is infertile? The 1st egg my bird laid is seperate of the other 2 which she is now incubating. She pushed the 1st egg from the other 2 and I candled it yesterday and I didn't see anything. I also candled it today because she is still rejecting it, still nothing... so I don't know if she is accidentally missing it or if she knows it is infertile. I candled the 2nd one too and it has been 4 days. Would I be able to see the spider shape on the 4th day or does it appear on the 5th or a later day?
     
  19. charmedagain

    charmedagain New Member

    The food that my birds love is EMP its a food designed to handfeed and wean chicks it can be given to all birds from finch's to parrots.

    You can give it to the birds moist or like me dry i just put a seperate dish in the cage with it in and my birds love it they did not seem interested at first but after a few hours they started eating it.

    It contains everything birds need all the vitamins minerals stuff like that so there is no need to put supplements in food or water.
    Female birds still need there cuttlefish bone even when they are eating this food i will give you some links about the food...

    As for the egg it maybe that she is getting ready to lay another egg and they usually push some or all the eggs to one side while she lays what you can do is when she leaves the nest mark the egg she keeps kicking out with a small x and place it in the centre of the other eggs see if she does throw it out if she keeps doing so she knows there is something wrong with that egg.

    Do not remove it just leave it in the nest until all other eggs hatchits best to wait 5-7days after the 3rd egg was laid this way it gives her time to have incubated them for awhile if they are not fertile still leave them with her for 21days or until she abandons the nest and eggs..

    http://www.petsparade.com/product.asp?prod=166

    http://www.merrisbirdsnsupplies.com/pro ... gfood.html

    those are links to 2websites that has both egg foods on them if you do a search you maybe able to find it on sale in your are one is called EMP egg food the other is, cede egg food..

    Hope this has helped.
    Mike
     
  20. ilovemycockatiels

    ilovemycockatiels New Member

    You know I did notice that now my bird has the egg she rejected under her. :eek: She was supposed to lay another egg today but she won't let me near them so I have to wait until she comes out to eat and stuff, then I can see and I'll mark the 4th one if there is one. The 1st egg (the one she was rejecting) has 1 dot on it so I won't need to put an x on it. Can you see any spider shape on the 4th day or is it only after the 5th day? I candled the 1st one when she was rejecting it and it had been 5 days but I saw nothing. I also candled the 2nd egg which it would've been on it's 4th day. Does the spider shape only appear 5 days after incubation starts or 5 days after it being laid? I might get some of that food you were talking about. Do they also feed this to the babies once they are born? or is it just for calcium and stuff?
     

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