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demodectic mange

Discussion in 'Dogs - Pit bull breeds specific' started by MO, Aug 12, 2004.

  1. MO

    MO New Member

    Our four month old Pitt was recently diagnosed with demodectic mange. He is currently under a vet's care and being treated with daily doses of Interceptor. Have you heard of anything else that treats this type of mange successfully? Our baby, Griffin, is losing hair all over and is terribly itchy. From what I have read in some cases, the mange isn't treatable and the dog must be put down.

    Any help would be most appreciated!

    MO
     
  2. Freedom

    Freedom New Member

    Daily doses of interceptor to treat demo mange? At the vet I work at they do mitaban dips, I really don't recommend the dips because you have to do A LOT of dips for it to even be effective. What I suggest you use is Ivomec, which works miracles. If is a mite killer for cattle and swine and takes care of the demo mites right away. Ask your vet about it, if they don't carry it, then you can purchase it any farm/feed store. Demo mange is very treatable, so don't think that your gonna have to put your dog down. As long as you get your dog treated he will be fine, he won't get better over night, it will take about 2 months, but he will get better if you use the Ivomec. It has been awhile since I used Ivomec, so I need to look up the proper dosage you would need to use, how much does he weigh?
     
  3. LilBamaCutie17

    LilBamaCutie17 New Member

    Pit Bulls Demodectic Mange

    Hi I have an 8 month old pit. She was diagnosed with Demodectic mange when she was about 6 months. My vet gave me Ivermec. It WORKS. Her spots where her hair were missing started growing back. Now she's good as new! try that and see if it works. It worked for me
     
  4. faeriedust1127

    faeriedust1127 New Member

    Maybe you are confusing what your dog has with sarcoptic mange? They are 2 different types and as far as i know, sarcoptic is the one that is more difficult to treat and is contagious to humans. As long as your dog is getting treated for it, i wouldn't worry about the possibility of him not overcoming it.
     
  5. Piper's Mom

    Piper's Mom New Member

    Piper has been battling this for the past 2 1/2 months. She looks like a moth has been eating her hair! My vet is treating her with Ivermectin (the main ingredient in Heartgard). She has advised me that this can take several months of treatments before the problem is fully resolved. The good news is that most of the time, especially with young pups like ours, it is 100% treatable. (But yes, left untreated, it can lead to serious infections and even death.) We go in every 3 weeks for skin scrapings. She showed me the mites under the microscope - they look like little cigars. During the second round of treatment Piper's hair had begun to grow back and the shedding had begun to lessen, then the spots began to appear in different places and it started all over again. Currently, she is getting better again, but I'm afraid to get too excited just yet. My vet said the dip smells absolutlely terrible and would take a minimum of 8 trips, so she did not recommend it. Two weeks ago on our last visit, she gave me an orangy/pinkish cream to apply to the spots I see and a fish oil supplement to put in her food, because she was getting very dry patches around the spots she had been scratching. Her coat (if you can look past the moth-eaten looking areas) looks shiny and beautiful already. I think Goob posted the other day that some human fish oil supplements can be used for dogs coats at a much cheaper price. I am going to ask my vet about this on our next visit. (sorry Goob if it wasn't you!) Also, in the beginning when Piper was scratching herself to death, we gave her (at our vet's suggestion) Benadryl twice a day. For me, the shedding is the worst part of this - I feel like I have been bathing in her hair by the end of every day. Anyway, sorry to be so long-winded, but this subject hits very close to home for me. The best thing about your case that I can see is you are getting the problem treated, so I have no doubt your baby will be just fine :y_the_best: ... you just have to have A LOT OF PATIENCE! Good luck and let us know how your progress goes - it will be interesting to compare notes.

    Pipers Mom
     
  6. goob

    goob New Member

    Not to mention it's carcinogenic. Interceptor can be used to treat demo, but it's much costlier than the other options. Ivermectin is probably then cheapest, but can cause severe reactions in some herding breed dogs, so that's something to be considered in dogs of unknown heritage or known herder breeds in them.

    Since demodectic mange isn't really about the mites being present (they're there on every dog, and even humans, though I think a different type), but rather the dog's immune system being weak enough for the mites to cause damage, the mange may return later in the dogs life should the immune system become stressed or weakened, which in some (rare) dogs, is a permanent state. You can try to prevent reinfestations by keeping the dog in as best health possible, feeding a good food, and if necessary, supplements to keep their immune system up. Dogs with generalized or recurring mange should be spayed or neutered, as they can pass on their weak immune system to their offspring, and going through heats (females) or being around females in heat (males) can often stress their system enough to cause another outbreak. Generally, when the demo is localized (in one or two small areas), it either goes away with treatment, or sometimes even on its own as the dog matures and their immune system develops, and is not a problem again. It is pretty rare for a dog to have to be put down for mange.

    And it was me who suggested human fish oil piper's mom, my dogs have been on human fish oil for the past year, and their coats are like silk, so shiny. It's also helped clear up my older girl's allergies, which is a definite bonus.
     
  7. Piper's Mom

    Piper's Mom New Member

    Goob - What specifically are you giving your dogs? I would like to get some, too.

    I thought I might add, my vet believes Piper's condition was possibly brought on by her extremely fast growth rate - which could have compromised her immune system. Also, at 4 months I sent her to an in-house obedience school. We had her spayed at 6 months. She says the stress of either of these or both, combined with the fast growth rate were probably just too much for her system to handle. She did warn me that this could come back later in her life.
     
  8. Samsintentions

    Samsintentions New Member

    Interseptor is a Heartworm, whipworm, roundworm, and pin worm Once a month wormer..... NOT for mange.


    You need to use a Mitacon dip or (crap, just lost all train of thought...UGH!!!) OH, anyhow, it starts with a P...don't know the name but its a shampoo. You need to take him to a diffrent vet.....honestly.


    In the good Ol' days, they would tie a dog upor confine it to a small inclosure and rub the dogs entire body down with burnt motor oil...that is just as effective, but unhealthy for the dog if they injest any of the oil...
     
  9. goob

    goob New Member

    Initially, they got salmon oil gelcaps from Walmart, which seemed to do the job, coat improved, etc. They were on those for about 8 months, and had no problems. The last bottle I've gotten (usually 250 caps will last 2-3 months for my 55 lb and 15 lb dog) was from Whole Foods market, the oil is molecularly distilled, and I believe is from wild fish, not farmed. The molecular distillation (is that a word?) gets rid of any toxins in the oil that were built up in the fishes' bodies, and it is said that wild fish are better for consumption than farmed, as they are not given antibiotics, hormones, etc. I guess it could be compared to free range organic beef vs the average grocery store kind. I haven't noticed much of a difference, except Goo's eye boogies (she never really had a problem with it, but it was noticeable) have become less common, and an ear infection she'd had on and off went away. I started those caps around the beginning of november though, and it's just as likely that the eye boogies and ear infection were seasonal allergies were not related to anything in the other oils. The price for the Whole Foods brand and Walmart brand were about the same though, so I'll probably either stick with the WF caps or check some closer vitamin shops to see if they offer the same. Dunno if you saw in my other post, but if you give fish or flaxseed oil, you should also give vitamin E with it, I get the dog's vit E from a vitamin shop at the mall, got a membership card for them, and go on sale days, last time I got 4 months supply for the 2 dogs for under $5. You can find the vit E just about anywhere, but make sure it is d-alpha tocopherol, not dl-alpha tocopherol, as the latter is synthetic vitamin E, and not as effective as the real stuff. Goo is 55 lbs, and she gets one 400iu vit E gelcap and 2-3 fish oil gelcaps every night. You can safely give up to 1000mg fish oil per 10 lbs body weight, though I'd work up to that slowly if you give that much or she may get the runs. With the gelcaps, you can either puncture them and squirt the oil onto their food, put the caps into their food, or just give them the caps like treats. Two of our dogs think they're treats, one will only eat them in her food.
     
  10. Piper's Mom

    Piper's Mom New Member

    Shampoo's and dips are not the only method of treatment. In fact, they are actually the least effective course of treatment and take the longest time to achieve results. I have done A LOT of research on this since Piper was diagnosed and have spent a lot of time with my vet. Ivermectin is the main ingredient used in Heartgard. It is given full strength, beginning with the smallest dose possible and gradually increased as needed. While taking this, you skip the monthly heart worm preventitive pill. The same is true with Interceptor. As with any course of treatment, this may not be possible to use on some dogs - particularly old or unhealthy dogs. This treatment can be hard on a dogs liver. As Goob mentioned, some specific breeds of dog have shown not to be good candidates. Most puppies make a full recovery with no lasting side effects.
     
  11. shyangel333

    shyangel333 New Member

    ?? ?? ?? ??

    HOW DO THEY GET SOMETHING LIKE THIS????
     
  12. Samsintentions

    Samsintentions New Member

    Either by coming in contact with another animal (dogs arent theonly animals that get it), or bein in unhealthy conditions. Hanky (one of my rescues) got it from being in a kennel that I had recently put a dog in with it. (Need I say, I did bleach it and sterilize it before she was put in it) But it can get into the ground....
     
  13. mattbone

    mattbone New Member

    demodectic mange is not contagious. its a genetic disorder that causes the immune system to be ineffectice against the mites. mitaban usually takes about six dips ( once a week ) in conjunction with ivomectin and generally has no side effects. also after the treatment relapses are rare except in the most severe cases. females are more susceptible to the disorder because of their hormonal shifts. males usually on show it during puberty or extreme old age. females with extreme cases could show it everytime they come into heat. having the male or female spayed or neutered virtually garauntees it never to come back. other effective remedies are sulphur based creams or oils. nu-stop is very effective for mild cases. in any case it is very common among pits and often can go unnoticed in a bloodline because of breeders regular use of ivomec and sometimes can show up in two ipeccable dogs because they were latent carriers. with proper treatment however it as inconsequential as the chicken pox. just one of those things that goes along with the breed.
     
  14. goob

    goob New Member

    I agree with most of your post except the above. Mitaban tends to make dogs lethargic for a while after being dipped, and some dogs have more severe reactions to it.

    Demodectic mange is not contagious, the mites that cause it are present on all dogs, but only dogs with weak immune systems will be symptomatic. Weak immune system is genetic, though poor nutrition/environment can also cause the immune system to be weakened, and mange to become present.
     
  15. Piper's Mom

    Piper's Mom New Member

    Thank you for helping to clear that up guys!

    Goob - I appreciate all of the information on the supplements. I am going to give them a try and will let you know.
     
  16. Piper's Mom

    Piper's Mom New Member

    Thought I would share:

    American Pit Bull Registry's January 2005 Newsletter

    (Copy and distribute freely but please provide credits and link to www.AmericanPitBullRegistry.com)

    Demodectic (Red) mange

    Often referred to as Red Mange, Demodectic mange (canine demodecosis) is caused by the mite Demodex canis.

    Although the majority of dogs have this mite, some who have impaired immune systems are susceptible to having this mite reproduce in a way that their immune system cannot effectively keep the mite in check. This weakened immune system seems to often be a genetic trait passed on by the parents.

    Weakened Immune Systems:

    Weakened immune systems are often associated with inbreeding practices. Whether the weakened immune system simply comes from breeding other immuno-suppressed dogs or as the result of the elimination of genetic diversity through inbreeding/line breeding, this condition is no fun to the dog and can be financially draining to its owner. When considering buying a new dog of any breed the potential for having a weakened immune system should be a serious consideration in ones choice. The APBR recommends no closer than 4 generations when inbreeding/line breeding is a consideration in a breeding program. These 4+ generations help to support a diverse genetic base and builds a foundation for a long-term healthy life for the offspring.

    There are three primary forms of Demodectic mange:

    Localized:

    This form will often go away on it's own. This is typically characterized by a well-defined red scaly lesion and hair loss most often occurring on the face and forelegs. Although treatment may be given to this type of mange, it is often advised that it not be done so as to be able to determine the level of the immune system in the animal and to be able to make a determination as to whether or not it will become generalized.

    If treated too early this determination cannot be arrived at accurately.

    Generalized:

    This is typical of a dog that has a genetically weak immune system. This is characterized by enlarged lymph nodes, red scaly lesions and hair loss that spreads over the entire body. This weakened immune system is often a trait inherited from genetically weak parents and can cause issues for the pet the entirety of its life. Any pet determined to have this form of mange should be spay/neutered.

    Any pregnant animal that has been determined to have this condition should be spayed after recovery from birth. It is important not to treat this animal until it is fully recovered as this period in their life is stressful and added stress can cause treatment of the condition to be much more difficult and have a lower rate of success.

    After birth, it is imperative that the babies be IMMEDIATELY removed and not allowed contact with the infected mother. Hand-raising these babies will be necessary to help in the prevention of infection. Because of the hereditary component of this type of red mange and the care involved with hand-raising the babies, those affected do not make good breeding candidates and such attempts should never be undertaken.

    Demodectic Pododermatitis:

    This is where the mange has confined itself to the paws. In many cases this mange must be determined through biopsy and is often accompanied by bacterial infections.

    Treatment:

    Treatment is typically undertaken by a vet and can be quite costly. The drug Amitraz (Mitaban) is often used and can cause bad reactions for people who are exposed to the treatment and are taking serotonin reuptake inhibitors (such as Prozac). Because of this both those treating the animal and those who have exposure to the treated animal should be aware of the possible health risks to themselves. This type of treatment should also never be used on any toy breeds or young puppies.

    Other treatments do exist, but vary in their effectiveness and should be reviewed by your treating veterinarian.

    In older times people would attempt to treat such mange with motor oil. THIS IS NOT AN EFFECTIVE TREATMENT. IT WILL NOT WORK. In addition to it not working, attempting it will put your pet at great risk since it is likely that they will lick much of it off and cause sever kidney and liver damage because it is toxic to the body and in many cases lead to death. That which is not licked off can be absorbed through the skin and cause severe blood pressure drops and lead to death as well.
     
  17. True_Pits

    True_Pits New Member

    Thats another thing I don't agree with in APBR, the inbreeding thing, well I think its good in their case considering they are a registry for bybs and their breedings (esp inbreedings) cause all sorts of problems. I agree that Inbreeding can cause a weaker immune system if you are using the wrong dogs. I find that blue dogs often get this disease at sometime in their lfe, most blue dogs and these blue breeders are breeding dogs with weaker immune systems even though they don't inbreed. Their dogs are prone to parvo and mange. I've also noticed red nose and white (or mostly white) dogs more often having mange in breeding programs even though these programs do not practive inbreeding. I've never had a problem with any of my dogs having mange and none of their relatives are known to me to have ever had mange. Almost everytime I see a dog come up with mange its from poor or unknown breeding.

    I think its the first, eliminating genetic diversity probably isn't it. If you are breeding healthy dogs with good immunity and no other health problems/defincientcies then you shouldn't have any problems by inbreeding them or linebreeding them.

    JMO though.
     
  18. Piper's Mom

    Piper's Mom New Member

    I agree - I wish everyone cared as much about about the puppies and their health. Unfortunately, too often, this doesn't seem to even be on the priority list!
     

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