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Inside or Out?

Discussion in 'Dogs - Pit bull breeds specific' started by Angie, May 8, 2004.

  1. Angie

    Angie New Member

    I was just wondering about something...

    Sometimes when I see pictures of puppies on the net, the pups are outside in a kennel.
    Shouldnt you keep pups inside? Is it safe to put them out before they get their shots?
    Even though it was a mess, my brother kept his litter inside until they were all sold. He never put them out.
    So, at what age is it safe to keep them outside for the people that keep them outside and do you think most breeders keep them in or out?
     
  2. Sara

    Sara New Member

    At a kennel and when the mother is up to date on her shots etc... Keeping pups outside with mom and other dogs in the Kennel it's okay but when it's just a household and the pups go out every once in awhile it's not safe to do so until the pups get their Parvo and Distemper shots (not sure when that is yet).

    I hope that made sense...
     
  3. chickee

    chickee New Member

    Weather permitting, I let puppies stay outside in their 'puppy kennel' as early as 4 - 5 wks. We live out in the country and don't have problems like parvo, but I would be more concerned if I lived in heavily populated areas.
     
  4. Angie

    Angie New Member

    Thanks for your replys.
    Sara, I was a little confused by your post but I reread it and I think I understand what you were sayin.
    And thanks Chickee for your input.
    :D
     
  5. True_Pits

    True_Pits New Member

    I believe its safe and nice for them to be able to go out and get some fresh air. And to socialize them to the "outside" knowing there is more then the walls and shelter that have surrounded them and for the sake of potty training.
     
  6. Sara

    Sara New Member

    :oops:

    I was sleepy when I posted and hoped it would make sense...

    As a Kennel the pups would be surrounded by dogs that the breeder owns...the pups would be surrounded by vaccinated dogs as well as having some immunity passed on to them by mom... So that's what I was saying about them living outside... It'd be great for them socially to do this and healthy...

    But if I were to have puppies and then took them outside...they're less protected (more open area etc...) and more likely to pick something up...even if they have immunity from some of it from their momma...

    So... Hobby breeders will mostly all have pups inside safe...while Kennels (2-3 litters a year) will mostly have their pups outside with the rest of the kennel.
     
  7. True_Pits

    True_Pits New Member

    What's a hobby breeder?

    What's a kennel?
     
  8. Sara

    Sara New Member

    Hobby breeder... You know the people who have a couple show dogs (two or one) and choose to breed them once every so often... The ones that typically show up on that Baby show on Animal Planet... Only a degree better than a BYB IMO.

    Kennel.../breeder... You know the type that breeds 2-3 litters a year... a Reputable breeding operation...etc...

    Make sense...?
     
  9. True_Pits

    True_Pits New Member

    It somewhat makes sense I just have a different opinion. I was wondering about the people on thats my baby. But I don't see how having breeders who have a large yard and breed 2-3 litters a year is any better. This is just my opinion of course but I don't think a reputable breeder should have to be breeding 2-3 litters a year. What is wrong with 1 litter a year? Overbreeding needs to stop. My idea of reputable doesn't have to do with the number of dogs or litters (unless their are too many). Do these Hobby breeders actually show their dogs? Or are they just "show dogs" because of the lines?
     
  10. Samsintentions

    Samsintentions New Member

    I do rescues as yall know.... If a bitch comes to me, has a litter of puppies (like just recently) they go into what I call the qarentine kennel. Its outside and half covered. I spray the ground and everything in it with a strong bleach solution, before the pups are put in there and weekly, and of course after they leave it.

    Now my dogs, when they have pups, they are born and raised inside until they get their shots at 4 wks. after a fewdays of getting vaccinated they gointo a kennel. Again its bleached like the quarentine kennel. But they are brought inside every night or when we aren't home. After 6 wks. they can stay outside all day. If the owners want a dog thats going to live outside predominantly, I'll designate those puppies to stay outside with momma, the ones that will be inside pups, will stay inside. I begin all puppy training at 5 wks. All puppies are house and kennel trained before they go to their homes.


    A good breeder will introduce puppies to most all situations. Vets office, parks, homes, and people and other animals. My pups that go for herding dogs, will begin herd training at 6 wks. THey go into the roundpen with calves or sheep and start from there. Daddy usually shows them what to do. As for commands, I teach that.....


    Puppies need to learn early a routine. ITs hard on them to go from one routine that the breeder provided to a new home with strangers and a diffrent routine.
     
  11. Sara

    Sara New Member

    "Breeder" by default would be someone who breeds to get more of their chosen breed out there and purchased by the public etc... Sure they're for the betterment of the breed and when they're at the beginning of their operation without an established line yes they will have more than 1 litter a year and if there is a demand for their dogs then yes they will have more than one litter a year...

    Most of the folks I've seen on the AP show do actually show their dogs... A few of them are breeders with a whole yard of dogs...they show them and work them and sell puppies...

    Reputable to me means breeding for the betterment of the breed... Hobby to me means showing your dog...got a good show dog...buying another show dog...showing them both...doing well at a few shows and deciding to breed for all of your freinds who'd like to try their hand at showing etc... Or for pets... to me that's not necessarily bettering the breed by any means...

    When it comes to APBT's... there shouldn't be any new breeders out there and some of the semi-reputable and hobby breeders need to quit and start rescuing.

    Do you see my point in differences etc...?
     
  12. True_Pits

    True_Pits New Member

    Yes I understand what you mean now. Think I'm pretty much in agreemnt. I thought some of the breeders on AP showed and on a couple they had other breeders come over and evaulate the pups as far as conformation. I've watched some of the cat breeders too. I just disagree about the litters part I guess. Having 2-3 littes doesnt make some one more reputable then another who chooses to only breed 1. Or a peddler who may have multiple litters to sell the pups vs those who would rather see them in the right hands where they will be used. But I don't agree with breeding for pets either, thats kind of ridiculous even if they GAVE all the pups away to "good" homes, still doesn't make it right.
     
  13. Sara

    Sara New Member

    It's not the ammount of litters that makes the breeder reputable...

    It's the reason for breeding... Many breeders breed that many because there is that much demand for their puppies... Other breeders of more unrefined breeds breed that many to refine their line and make their breeding program better... Double breedings would cut down on that immensly... I wonder why that isn't very common... (two studs one litter)... ?

    We're on the same page no doubt... I just don't want to be misunderstood.

    I dont' think a reputable breeder, no matter the demand, should be breeding more than 3 litters a year...

    Do you see what I'm saying???

    Working breeders barely have THAT (once they have a line and program that is refined).

    It take litters to better the breed...but those litters must be thought out, culled and responsibly rehomed etc...

    Lots of "reputable" breeders IMO are one step away from being puppymills in most cases... so many people breed for quantity instead of quality and lost of people deemed reputable fall in that category...

    It's unfortunate and buyers NEED to be educated.
     
  14. True_Pits

    True_Pits New Member

    We are definatly on the same page. It isn't the amount of litters thats what I was saying too. I'm not saying they wouldn't have 2 or 3 litters, but don't see a problem when they only have one. I have a friend who I'm pretty certain only bred 1 litter last year and didn't sell any pups, did end up trading one of his pick females he was going to keep. So now he ended up with 1 male and 1 female the one he traded for was also a female. I also know where the other pups went. I do know another who bred 3 and sold a few. Had a couple others that didn't take. So it depends on that breeders situation and plans what there breeding and how many litters they need, what they are looking to produce, which bitch they need a litter off of.
    All dogs should be bred for a reason and purpose in mind and pet or money shouldn't be a reason. I think we agree on that point. Culling is very important but it seems so many breeders forget about it or don't see it important. Breeding for demand?? Breeders shouldn't be breeding for filling supply and demand. The betterment of the breed and the continuence of the line should be in mind. Demand and selling pups shouldn't be.
     
  15. Sara

    Sara New Member

    Demand as in need for quality dogs...

    Like you said it depends on what breed you're talking about and what the breeder is breeding for... If the breed is severely lacking in quality working individual's but there is a demand for those types and a lack of breeders who fit the bill and dogs who fit the bill...then breeding to create more of a good thing because of demand for it...I see that is quality, reasonable breeding (but then that's still less than 3 litters in a year--unless the size of the Kennel is considerable--but even then)... So...one litter is fine but if there is demand for quality individuals, diversity etc... then up to three could also be reputable... More than that to me is on the verge of puppy milling.
     
  16. True_Pits

    True_Pits New Member

    I agree with that. So it does depend. At first by saying 1 litter vs 2-3 litters can give people the very wrong idea. Thinking to be a "kennel" they need to get several dogs and offere several breedings a year even though they are just a BYB with a yard of dogs. But I completly understand what you are saying. The only part I disagree with is the being a puppy mill by having more than 3 litters a year. Like you said it depends on what that person needs. Puppy mills are also a business if you're not breeding dogs for money and breeding for the right reasons and not over breeding your dogs then a puppy mill shouldn't be considered, they are a responsible breeder that happen to be having more than 3 litter in one year. On another board it was also said that having more than 3 breeding females would mean that "breeder" is close puppy mill. I disagree with that too. Just my opinion but I see no reasoning behind it.
     

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