Is this play or aggression

Sorry if this issue has already been addressed.

I have a 12 wk APT (Male). I also have a 2 yr old pit mix. The baby loves to play with the older female. He gets really wild, biting at her face and legs. Not really hard but constant. she gets annoyed and I keep expecting her to snap or bark at him. She just takes it. Is this just play that will end, or is he trying to be dominant. could this elevate to aggressive behavior. Should I try to brake it up.

 

I myself do not allow escalated play because it can easily turn to aggression or dominance... I've always cut my dogs off early before they get too involved with they're play... Better to start young with it and teach him that YOU are the boss about play along with EVERYTHING else... EASIEST way to get control... When my two girls got into it...the biggest problem was that I could not correct the foster...she didn't understand so when I said no...she didn't quit...and my girl could only take so much herassment at that point... It escalated VERY quickly... Having control of your dog is a must especially in a multiple dog home with a pit...

YOU control who does what, when, for how long... I would correct the behavior if you can or put the other dog up and direct the pup to a rigorus game of tug to get her energy level down... YOU always win the tug match and end or begin the game... You should be good to go... Is the pup enrolled in any puppy OB classes? I'd recommend that as well.

 

Adult dogs will always try and put puppies in their place. Your 12 week old pup at this time can be put in his place but if the older dog is a female, the pup a male it is more likely that at some point the pup will be dominant over the female. Having always had a house full of dogs I have allowed them 'to a point' to deal with 'squabbles' themselves. When you interfere in every little squabble it builds up any underlying frustrations. Obviously I dont leave some of my dogs unsupervised with others, I will stop a serious fight but most fights are more vocal....a lot of growling, pinning down. If you watch any 'wild dog' documentary you will see that there is usually an alpha male and alpha female...all the others are subordinates, when the alphas become old or injured a subordinate with a dominant tendancy will then try and take over. Its all part of the heirarchy.

I think your female is just teaching the pup how to behave socially, as long as there is no serious attacking going on it sounds as though they are getting along as normal.

 

Dogs have an ever fluctuating heirarchy and it's been discovered that it often depends on the situation which dog is more dominant... Some will let one dog eat before another... the dog eating last would normally be the passive one... But come to sleep...squables will arise when the last dog to eat decides he/she gets the best place to sleep...it's worth it to that dog to assert dominance in that case... It's not COMPLETELY like wolves or wild dogs... similar but not completely.

PLUS Pit Bulls were bred for generations to not only fight for dominance but to fight more as an outlet than a display... OFTEN times pits will ONLY posture themselves in a dominant manner... Rather than actually dueling it out physically... You can get into the physical fight faster than you can snap your fingers and to break them apart can be messy... You have one pit and one pit cross so this is helpfull in a way... One dog is less likely to go all out... BUT still likely none-the-less. I have a house full of 5 dominant dogs... THEY know I am the boss when it comes to displays of aggression and they dont' do it... No stress involved and no reason to duke it out because I am the be all and end all... I don't see ANY problems with frustration... I've not heard of any TRUE problems of frustration in this instance and did a long study on dog behavior, pack social behavior in terms of human intervention and obedience in aggressive and dominant dogs particularly... It is a common mis-conseption that stopping the dogs from arguing and bickering causes frustration in the dogs...

HOWEVER... Look at a wolf pack... the alpha pair ARE the boss...no one squables if THEY are not willing to let them squable... No one plays if they are not willing to play or let them play... Dogs are merely the immature wolves and so they respond well to our human controls... I've known and spoken to MANY pit bull owners, trainers, handlers and the best way to keep the peace is to become THE boss in all situations... Letting them duke it out can become ugly and can in the long run cause more problems in the end... Asserting dominance is one thing but when one dog will not submit...GAME IS OVER and I say so. We get a frustrated dog on our hands (not because of us but because the other dogs dominance is wrong for them) then one or the other dogs is removed from the situation, crated, put outside... After a time we all come back and it's all good again...

I've had dogs my whole life and studied animal behavior extensively in this situation... I think if you're experienced in animal behavior and capable and willing to take on the responsibility of possible escalation into a full on fight of magnitude then by all means...let them sort it out...if not... Just be the boss in every situation.

 

Thanks for the advice.

 

Its common knowledge that this DOES cause frustration.

Im just curious where you extensive studying was done, which experts did you study under. I always like to keep an open mind and Im always willing to look at any reputable trainers or behaviourists experiences to expand my 'apparant' lack of knowledge in dog behaviour.
Thankyou.

 

Its been my experience that the older female is always the dominant one, this may be due to something that my behavior has intorduced into the relationships, as well as the fact that I have never owned a male that I didnt breed and own the dam first. I have never experienced a fight between a mother and son...

I leave them alone together sometimes albeit infrequently(the seven month old male is crated in our absence most always), and never worry about them fighting, rather than chewing stuff up!!

I would worry if I were to introduce another dog of either sex into my "pack", there would probably be a fight, in fact im sure they would fight.

Im sure someone has had different experiences though, this is coming from someone who trusts my dogs alone with my child though, so maybe im crazy!! LOL....

I think dog behavior can also be greatly influenced by the owner, im not sure there is an "end all animal psycology" so to speak, Dogs like people are amazing in their talent for adaptation, The "wolf pack" theology only floats so far, I mean, we as people dont go around excusing or modeling our actions after cavemen......

It may be more like abstract art. The meaning changes with each person who interprets it, ultimately if it works for you great, if it doesnt work for you- go with a different method, if it doesnt work for you and you dont go with a different method, you dont need dogs. This is an area where animals and children make some behavioral specialist and pharmacudial companys rich, the parents are often times not assertive enough to TELL dogs and children how they should behave, (taking into account obvious innate traits, dogs are dogs and the "terrible two's" will always be....)neither dogs nor children read the books that "experts" write, but then again I hate Andy Warholes Pop Art and Dr. Phils Pop Psyc.......

Im sorry if this is off topic, Dont leave your pitbulls alone with one another because its generally and specifically not that kind of breed. It may be a mock aggression on the puppies part, just "priming the pump" if you will, that can quite possibly turn ugly.

 

The wolf pack theory I used as a base, in my opinion anyone who owns any pet should do some research on that particular animal, its a good place to start. When people are pregnant, the first thing they want to do is read every baby book, watch videos about babies etc it will give them an idea of what to expect, what to learn, it doesnt mean that their baby is going to do exactly as the babies on the videos, so watching either undomesticated dogs or anything with packs of dogs, watching their behaviour how they interact with other dogs can at least give people an idea about dog socialization, about alpha and submissive dogs and everything in between. Experience has shown me over and over again that any breed of dog can get into a fight, dogs that have lived together for 5 years in perfect harmony can 'suddenly turn', Ive seen many an older female come in to be stitched up or worse after a 2 year old male or female that was introduced to 'the pack' as a puppy has taken it down. Enviroment can change the behaviour of any dog but the basic instincts are still there and in some situations will show through.
As for a comment earlier about the alpha dogs not allowing any squabbling from the subordinates, all I can say is there must have been some serious creative editing going on in the documentaries to show subordinates getting a little rough with each other.
Everyone has different experiences and so when someone asks a question I personally dont respond unless I have experience and knowledge on that topic, I enjoy reading other peoples opinions and experiences, theres nothing wrong with gaining more knowledge. I dont always agree with other people opinions but I dont critisze or discount them nor do I pick every comment they make to pieces which seems to be something that a particular poster is too quick to do when she does not agree with someone.

 

I am far from an expert on this subject. I hate dog fights. But here is an article I enjoyed reading.
Sue



Multiple Dog Households

Many volunteers are interested in fostering, but hesitate because they don't know how the foster dogs will interact with the resident dog(s). Some potential adopters share the same concern. PAW volunteer Lawrie Rich offers advice and an excellent article that can help ease the transition.

"Why do all the dogs get along in my house? Because I am the Ultra Alpha, but also I allow the dogs to be a pack," explains Lawrie. When introducing a new dog to the pack, Lawrie uses this system:

* Walk the new dog outside the fenced yard where the pack is, let them get close (sniffing and barking is natural and acceptable), then make sure the pack can't get into the house.

* Next, take the dog in, let him/her sniff around, then let two dogs in at a time, starting with the middle pack members. The second two dogs Lawrie lets in are the Omega and the Top Dog.

* As long as things progress smoothly, she continues letting the other dogs in two by two. This is done over the course of 1 to 1-1/2 hours.

"There are always little skirmishes between siblings here and there, just like with our children and adults, too," says Lawrie. The following article elaborates on the techniques Lawrie practices.

"Living With Multiple Dogs"
by Judith Halliburton, from Raising Rover

Far too often, by the time I'm called in on a "fighting dogs" case, there have been serious injuries, and I have to recommend that the client purchase prong collarsŐlease Human, if you have more than one dog, read this chapter carefully.

Memorize! Their relationship has to be established. There is no equality, there is no democracy. There has to be a dominant dog; there has to be a subordinate dog.

Memorize! There is no such thing as jealousy. There is no such thing as hurt feelings.

Dogs are pack animals; even though they are domesticated, pack etiquette is part of who they are. Canines in a pack will not injure, maim, or kill each other, because all members are needed for hunting. If one is injured or killed, it weakens the pack. They will not weaken the pack intentionally. I'm sure you have some idea of Rover's power and the strength of his jaw and teeth (even if he's a Chihuahua). If he wanted to injure, maim, or kill, he could.

Now that that's understood, Human, we can go on. I'm going to dispel the jealousy myth first. Jealousy is a very complicated emotion, with a lot of thought going into it. Dogs don't have the ability for that. What you see in dogs and call jealousy is one of two things: competition (which is the equivalent of sibling rivalry) or straightening out the peck order.

Let's say, for example, we have Rover One and Rover Two. Rover One is dominant. You're petting Rover Two, and Rover One approaches. His ears are up and forward, his tail is wagging, and his body is animated. That's competition. You can pet both dogs at the same time!

Straightening out the peck order works like this: You're petting Rover Two, and Rover One approaches. His ears are up and forward and his chest is out. If his tail is wagging at all, it's moving very slowly. There's no liveliness in his body, and there's purpose to his walk. He will attempt to get between you and Rover Two. He's saying that he doesn't want Rover Two that close to you. You'll notice that Rover Two attempts to back away. Let Rover Two go. He knows what he's doing.

When dogs fight over and over again, it's usually on account of incorrect human interference. For example, when Rover One is straightening out the peck order, the human tendency is to say, "Rover Two, honey, you come back here." To Rover One, you say, "Go on, I was petting Rover Two-first," and you push him away. Rover Two is thinking, "Please, oh please, oh please don't do this! I don't mind, I'll just go over here." Rover Two knows that Rover One will have to punish him later. Don't forget, they can't explain it to you. With your tone of voice, you praised Rover Two and disciplined Rover One. You compromised One's position as the dominant dog, and you did it in front of Rover Two.

When Rover One and Rover Two actually have a fight, our human tendency is to go immediately to the underdog, the one showing submission. You go to Rover Two and begin to check him for injuries, saying, "Are you all right? Did Rover One hurt you?" All this is said in a soothing, comforting voice. To Rover One, you say, "Rover One, shame on you! You get out of here and leave Rover Two alone! Bad dog! Bad dog!" All this is said in a stern tone. You praised Rover Two in front of Rover One, and disciplined Rover One in front of Rover Two. Again you've seriously compromised Rover One's position as the dominant dog. Both dogs now believe you want Rover Two to be dominant, and they're thinking, "Oh jeez, now we have to fight all over again!" because their relationship has to be reestablished as it applies to you and your position in the peck order. After a short time, you have two dogs that get along beautifully when no one's around and fight as soon as you're with them!

There's serious danger when this kind of fighting starts: the slightest provocation can start a fight. I call those stimulus fights. For example, the doorbell rings and both dogs run for the door. That can start a fight. They're in the yard, and they both bark at something. That can start a fight. You walk into the room. That can start a fight. Company can start a fight. When stimulus fighting begins, there is no longer any "fight posturing," and absolutely no pack etiquette. With the loss of pack etiquette, and fight posturing, the dogs may fight with the intent to hurt each other. They don't know why they're fighting...

It's very simple to prevent serious fighting. Simply don't interfere. Now, Human, I know that's not easy to do because when they start fighting, it sounds unbelievably vicious and you think they're killing each other. They are usually not hurting each other. A fight seldom lasts longer than three minutes. It only seems like an hour. Any injuries are usually accidental--a scratch on the face (from a toenail, or tooth) or a nick in the ear. Occasionally, there's a bleeding tongue. If you just can't help it, and you must get involved, do so without saying anything to either dog. If you believe you need to check for injuries, do it silently, and check Rover One-first.

Do not separate the dogs after a fight. By that I mean, don't put them in separate areas. If you do, you take the chance that they'll fight again as soon as they see each other. Don't attempt to break up a fight alone. You can get seriously bitten and the dogs won't even know they did it. If you honestly believe they're getting hurt, and you have a helper, each of you should grab one dog's tail or hind legs and pull. In my business, I learn constantly. I've just learned that hair spray can stop a fight quickly.

If you have dogs that are fighting or beginning to fight, you can ward off serious problems by putting a few rules into effect. If you absolutely, positively know that Rover One is dominant, give him preferential treatment. You don't have to make a big deal of it. Put his food down first. Pet him first when you come home or the dogs come in the house or you go out to get them. When you give Rover One preferential treatment, you are letting both dogs know that you respect Rover One as the dominant dog.

If you're not sure who is dominant, notice which one goes through a door first. Who's in front when they walk across they yard or the room? Don't base your opinion on food. Dogs have food available to them on a daily basis...Dogs can show dominance over food, but don't pin your opinion on that one thing. Pay attention when you see one dog walk across the room and hesitate in front of the other dog. The subordinate dog will turn his head a little and look away. Once he does that, the dominant dog will continue to walk.

If there's been a lot of fighting, sometimes it's very difficult to tell which dog is dominant, because the subordinate dog is constantly on the defensive. I liken him to a child who has been beaten up and pushed around by the school bully. This child's always on guard, looking over his shoulder and ready to defend himself at any moment. It could be the subordinate dog who's starting the fights. If one of your dogs is that defensive, you'll have to watch for subtle signs of who's dominant. Watch them closely and objectively. Objectivity is sometimes hard to achieve. You may have a favorite dog, and you want that one to be dominant Or one dog is of a breed you think should be dominant, and you refuse to believe that he's not.

Whatever your circumstances are, you can't deny the dominant dog. You must respect the dogs' relationship. You can't decide which one is going to be dominant.

If you have dogs that are fighting no matter what you do, take them to your veterinarian. It's possible the dog that doesn't seem to want to give up has a weakness of some kind; this could make him over defend himself. I had one case where the dogs had reached the point of intentionally injuring one another. It turned out one of them had serious hip dysphasia. In another similar case, one dog had a serious uterine infection.

There is one situation where I recommend interference. If you have an elderly dog with geriatric problems like cataracts or arthritis, or one that is weakened for some reason, put yourself in the Head Honcho position and protect that dog. Under most circumstances, the stronger dog will leave the weaker dog alone as long as it's understood that he's dominant. But every now and then I run into a dog that is a bully or has poor social skills.

Also there are dogs that will fight any other dog at any time for no apparent reason. These dogs are few and far between, and usually do fine if they remain in a home with no other dogs...

I hope that after reading this, you have a better understanding of the dynamics of the pack order and how important it is in your dogs' lives.

http://www.geocities.com/Augusta/2525/multidogs.htm

 

Great article, thanks.

 

Thanks, A good read!

 

I agree with many who have posted here

When I first got mystical she would nip at my sons face and his legs but I watched to see what was the cause of it! He squiled high pitch this hurts the dogs ears she was telling him to shut up but this was not her place to control this so I started as soon as I seen what was going on this is a No NO teeth are never to be used and then it stopped. I praised her when she was good and lowered my voice to a deep but calm sound and thats when she knows to stop what she is doing and now we dont have this problem any more.
She has chose one person to listen to I dont know if everyones pit is the same but Mystical and my other dog only listen to me.
They dont listen to other authority I spend every day every moment I have with these dogs.
My kids are involved and are higher up than the dogs the dogs are at lower rank.
And this is how we are in the home we are a pack and they are a part of us and have to behave on my comand.

I wish you luck...

 

I have a few problems with this article, but I'm not going to go into all of them, as I'd end up writing a book. But concidering the breeds specific to this site; Pit bulls and related breeds, I think there's a serious problem with one point of advice mentioned in the article.

When fights of any sort start between terrier breeds, and especially terriers who have a breed history for fighting in the first place, humans have to be ready to intervene, and not just let them settle it themselves. Unless you like the idea of huge vet bills to put your dogs back together or the possibility that one or both dogs may die from their injuries.

I've seen way too many squables over a favorite sleeping place quickly escalate into "You bit me, now you're going to die" fights. We have to be honest enough to accept the fact that terrier breeds were originally bred to kill something, be it rats or other dogs. Their predator instincts are sharper and closer to the surface than, say, a Maltese or cocker spaniel. And once their terrier is 'up', they're much less likely to back down.

In grooming, you learn really fast with terriers; if they get mad, put them up and let them get over it. If you continue to fight with them they just fight you all the more. "Don't trim my nails" quickly turns into "Touch me and I'll rip off your face, hair and eyeballs". And you can't blame to dog, that's what his ancestors were bred to be; tough, tenacious, scrappy dogs who don't give up until the job is done.

One thing I found usefull to seperate fighting dogs with less risk of injury to myself was a 4 foot square of plywood with hand holds cut into one side. Grab the plywood and wedge it between the fighting dogs to seperate them. If necessary, manuver one dog into a corner and hold him there until he comes to his senses.

With my own dogs, placing the combatants on seperate sides of the room, on a down/stay for ten minutes, often defused the situation. Then, if there were no injuries that needed immediate attention, and I had the time, both dogs took a turn at a quick, intense obedience session. After that, harmony usually returned and everyone got along.

 

Like I said earlier shine, we all have different experiences, what you describe working with terriers in grooming, Ive found in over 15 years as a tech that this is not usually the case and Ive seen dogs of just about every breed react the way you describe. Ive worked very closely with Pits and Am Staffs both in rescue and training and Im fully aware of the potential problems with the adrenilin and their 'fighting' backgrounds, Ive seen the fights among them especially with the rescues, and yes there are some that will go for the kill but so are there Akitas, Rotts, Dobies. It depends on each individual dog. I firmly believe that while there are people so strongly differentiating the behaviour of Pits compared to almost every other breed of dog then situations with things like BSL's will continue to come up.
A dog is a dog is a dog (as someone already stated). Im not saying that Pits and Pit type dogs cant do more damage than your average dog, of course they can but no more than a Rott or Dobie and the bottom line is they are dogs the 'general' heirarchy is no different than any other breed. I know quite a few people that have 4 or 5 Pits, they dont have the problems that some people here seem to say they do, they have allowed their dogs to sort out their own squabbles and 'fights' for dominance without any huge vet bills or any dogs being killed.
Again, different experiences.

 

Again, I'm no expert on this subject. I think it is something that we humans could study for years and still not get 100 percent correct. Isn't it an interesting subject though?
I do however own 6 dogs. 5 of them are am staffs, pit bulls and pit bull mixes. I also own a yellow lab/retriever. I have never not owned dogs. I have owned 6 for about 5 years now.
I don't get involved in "LITTLE SPATS'. The dogs work things out themselves. I understand that you need to always be on top of things though as I know things can escalate very quickly. You need to always be watching their body language and their behavior. Of course, if things seem to be getting out of line, someone will intercept. It's Usually my husband. For them most part thought, they respect the pack order and usually get along just fine.
So far, I have been very luck. I know the ranking order. My oldest pit bull mix Ginger (she is almost 5) is the Alpha dog. Within the dog pack, she surly "Rules the Roost". In the past when I would bring in a foster dog, it screwed up the pack order and the dogs would have to figure it out for themselves. Again, I have been very luck so far and not much more than a spat or two. I absolutely HATE dog fights. In my own home, I find that if anyone is going to start a fight, its my male yellow lab/ golden retriever. He usually is the instigator in the bunch. He has mellowed some I gather because he is getting older. He is 8 years old now.
This past summer, I was badly bitten and needed a 2 day hospital stay by my yellow lab/retriever. It was "Dominance aggression". Apparently he thought he was higher on the chain of command than I. When I went to take him by his collar to put him into the bedroom, he lashed out without warning (well probably very suttle and I did not have a chance to see) and bit me very badly on my left hand. I still do not have full use of it to this day. I had to go to a general surgeon, a plastic surgeon, and an occupational therapist. I was out of work for almost one month, and had to wear a cast! What an ordeal.
I hired a behaviorist who has her masters degree in psychology and had to teach "Dakota" who really was alpha. I had to re-obedience train him use the Nothing is for free way of schooling. I still am working with him. I have been working as a volunteer at our local humane society (where the behaviorist is employed) and have been learning dog behavior & obedience training for about one year now. It surly is very interesting. She is an awsome teacher. I will say this, the minute I think I know all there is to learn about dog behavior, I learn something new and begin to think that I don't know much at all. Even though, I have had dogs for 42 years!
I think I will continue to learn for years to come. I think we all can learn from each other.

 

I have a problem with this because my lab she went after my small dog she then chose later to attack my rott mix , I did my best to stop when it would begin and make them take time outs but some reason when she went after my rott mix and my rott fought back she remembered this and from then on there was no stopping them and not only did she attack my dogs she turned on my son. When this dog did that I knew she needed a home with no kids and no other pets she was very jealouse and I felt I couldnt be with her 24 hours a day and share my time with everyone else because any time we would all get together she would get jealouse of someone or something.

I also have a problem with it because not to be rude or anything but does sound like and I could be wrong but you almost made it sound like you fight your dogs.
But any ways
Funny thing is my rott and my pit get along fine my rott put her foot down to the pit and now when she barks my pit bows down.
I didn't want it to come to this I wanted us all to be happy in the home but it happen now we can move on they sleep together same crate everything and there is no problems.
No one has gone back for second round, yes it can always happen again but its my job as owner to make sure it never happens again.

 

How did you make that stretch from those comments?

 

I actually did my studying under a Biologist/behaviorist in college and also am finding new information always on the subject.

IF you do it correctly and your dogs KNOW without a doubt that you are the boss and that YOU set up the hieirarchy of the dogs no questions asked I've never seen frustration come of it... NEVER and I've seen several multiple PIT BULL households...

Your point is possibly and very likely true when you have a few dogs that live together on a regular basis without your supervision and then when inside they live by your rules... THAT I can see causing some serious frustrations... HOWEVER we're talking about APBT's who will hopefully NEVER be alone together to sort out any differences or figure out a pack hierarchy...becuse TECHNICALLY the breed was never meant to do so... fighting for APBT's is generally NOT something done for dominance rather than...a bit of a thrill. DeLaUK I never said you know little or nothing about anything... I simply have been relaying my own experiences...

FOR ME your idea that you should leave the two pit and pit mixes to duke it out for themselves is just asking for trouble... Keep the dogs separate and together ONLY with you and YOU are THE boss and YOU keep OB going on them and make sure you have BOTH under control at all times to STOP an arguement before it goes to far... AGAIN when I've had my own dogs...THIS has worked and does work and I've NOT seen ANY frustration mount between the two of them... They are also never alone together without supervision (never) and THIS helps to make this work without causing frustration...

My Boerboels on the other hand...they duke it out and live in a kennel TOGETHER for MOST of the time... I only get after them for rambunctious play but if I see a dominance issue coming to a head...they go outside and deal with it... THEY are not bred for fighting rather they're fight instinct is still more like that of the wolf where they do it in order to make the heirarchy work.

THIS is a Pit Bull and Pit Bull mix we are talking about and ANY time this breed is in the mix or on one end or the other of an arguement I think it is ALWAYS more detrimental to let them duke it out than it is to stop it in the bud before it gets going... again NEVER have I seen frustration mount in this situation... only when the lines are not clearly drawn by the handler/owner will the frustration be evident...

DeLaUK...what experts have you studied under? Since you asked me I figure it's fair game? THIS is a message board where we give advice based on our OWN experiences.... I'm giving mine based on my experiences and knowledge on the subject as are you... I don't remember exactly were it was that I read the dominance and heirarchy thing about dogs and being situational but I do beleive it was from a science or behavioral science journal---in other words a respectable source... I agree that domestic dog behavior cannot ALWAYS be attributed to wolves as it has evolved (hence wolves are wild and dogs are not) BUT wolf behavior is STILL very much something to pay attention to as it is a primal example of our dogs.

when talking about APBT's I beleive there are some fundamental differences as opposed to other dog behaviors... I'd NEVER expect an APBT to fight for dominance and once gained be done with the encounter never to begin again... ALSO I can never see an APBT who feels dominant LOSE in such a manner as to have given up the fight to the more dominant dog....it's not in their nature...if it was the breed would have NEVER become the famous pit dog that it was.

 

In Answer to KRAFTDOGG1's question, I asked my behaviorist what she would do in this instance. My answer was this:

1) Teach the puppy bite inbitihation skills.

2) Teach the puppy that it is not socially acceptable to act in this fashion.
Your pit bull mix is not correcting the behavior just taking it over and over again, so the dog owner should teach the puppy skills as to what is right and what is wrong behavior. Puppy is now just behaving as a rambunctious puppy than needs to learn manners.

3) Puppy should immediately go to puppy obedience school training and learn amongst his peers.

I hope this helps.


Bite Inhibition -- an Essential Part of Socialization



Dogs must learn to use teeth properly as part of behavior development. By helping dogs learn bite inhibition early on, you can help avoid bite incidents involving other dogs as well as people. This tipsheet contains information adapted from articles by Dr. Ian Dunbar in the November 1999 "Whole Dog Journal" and by September Morn in the April 2003 "DogFancy."

Dogs normally learn bite inhibition by 4 and a half months of age. Dunbar believes it's the single most important thing that dogs learn. So try to teach your dogs bite inhibition by age three months and reinforce throughout their lives.

Bite inhibition is a learned response in which the dog consciously inhibits the full force of his biting ability. Most dogs display bite inhibition when they are playing together, and even when engaging in a fight with another dog. If a dog does not have bite inhibition, he could injure and possibly even kill another dog.

Puppies who are properly socialized learn bite inhibition while nursing and playing. When pups bite while nursing, the mother dog will train them by standing up and walking away. When pups bite too hard during play with siblings, the bitten pup will yelp and stop playing with the rough pup. Or the bitten sibling might leap up and knock the rough-housing pup over with a loud bark or growl. This teaches a puppy that playtime ends if he bites too hard.

This is one reason puppies should go to puppy kindergarten or socialization class, where they can play and mouth while carefully supervised. They will learn that while gentle bites might be tolerated, hard bites will stop the play session.

People can use the same idea to teach their puppies bite inhibition.

* Sit down with the pup to play, bringing his attention to your hands. When the pup tries to bite your hand too hard, yelp or say "Oww!" firmly and stop interaction.

* Do not make your response sound like wincing or whining, or the pup may think it's part of the game. The pup needs to learn that fun stops when he bites.

* Give the pup a toy to chomp on instead of your hands or clothing. If he does not take the toy and instead nips again, stop interacting. Turn away, cross your arms, do not look back...you can even walk away.

* After time has passed, face your pup again and offer your hand. If he tries to bite, repeat the process.

* When your pup is gentle, pet and praise him calmly and resume play.

* If he bites again, say "Oww" as you did previously, and give him a 10-minute time-out. Leave the room, or better yet, place your pup in a time-out area. This area can be a separate room with no people or animal occupants, or in his crate. But avoid making this action seem like punishment -- you do not want the pup to learn to fear the crate or associate it with punishment. Time out is not the same as punishment. It is a suspension of playtime and fun.

* As you practice, the pup will use less and less pressure as he comes in contact with your hand.

* Keep in mind that the first goal is to teach the dog to actively inhibit the force of his bite, and THEN reduce the frequency. If you never let the pup put his jaws on you at all, when it does happen (say, an accident during which the dog's paw gets stepped on), the dog will probably react with an over-strong bite.

* Do not tap or smack the dog's nose as punishment for nipping -- instead of discouraging nipping, this tends to trigger instinctive biting in self-defense.

* Do not tease a pup or dog by flashing hands around his face or tapping his face. This can scare or startle the dog and trigger biting behavior, whether in play or self-defense.

* However, as the bite inhibition training progresses, you can gradually begin to incorporate some sudden movements into your play with the dog so he learns to be less spooked by human movement. If a dog is afraid of objects, you can help desensitize him by slowly incorporating hand-held objects into play.

* Daily grooming helps a dog get used to human touch. Teach your pup early on to allow you to touch his face and open his mouth. This will prepare him for activities like vet exams and tooth brushing. Start by gently raise the dog's lip and praise. You can also give a treat. Gradually lift the rest of his lip and examine the inside of his month.

Dunbar explains that no matter how hard you try to socialize a dog to people or other dogs, there may be times when it is not sufficient. For example, someone shuts the dog's tail in a door, or your dog is attacked by another dog. In these cases, your dog will instinctively respond by biting, whether it's out of provocation or self-defense. Whether or not your dog does damage depends on the level of bite inhibition that was established, usually before he reached age four and a half months.

Bite inhibition can be taught to a dog later in life, but it is more difficult and time-consuming. You will want to be prepared to avoid and control problems that may arise.

Dunbar believes that if a dog does not have bite inhibition, the dog should be muzzled when walking in public areas. Even if another dog starts a fight, your dog will be blamed if his bites cause damage.

Dunbar recommends the open-ended muzzles of soft but strong fabric, usually nylon, that control biting but are open in the front to allow the dog to drink, lick his lips and accept a treat. The goal is to train the dog to enjoy the company of other dogs, and to behave appropriately ... meaning sit, settle down, and be calm. So if a muzzle is used, choose a style that enables the dog to take treats.

Even using a muzzle, you must be fully vigilant. If you have or come into contact with other dogs, and you allow a dog to bite your muzzled dog, you will only reinforce in his mind that the other dogs should be bitten. So in training the dogs to get along, Dunbar advises muzzling your other dog(s).

Dunbar suggests these simple exercises to condition the biting dog to associate the presence of another dog with good things, not bad things:

* Put the biting muzzled dog on a leash, and sit down on the sofa, petting the dog. Have someone else enter the room with the other muzzled dog, and then leave after a few moments. Have the other dog and person repeatedly enter and leave the room.

* Give the biting dog two types of feedback. When the other dog leaves, totally ignore him. When the other dog enters, praise your dog and offer him pieces of kibble and perhaps treats, even if heUs growling and putting his hair up.

* Remember, the growling does not exist on its own. The dog is growling for a reason. If you give him a piece of kibble when the other dog comes in, you are classically conditioning the dog to form a positive association with the other dogs entry and presence.

* Eventually, the dog will form a positive association about the other dog and should, over time, stop growling because he will realize he has no reason to growl. "I don't particularly like that dog, but I love it when he comes into the room, because my owner talks to me, pets me, and gives me kibble." Timing is key, of course.

* For the next step, do the same exercise, but with the positions reversed. The other dog is in the room, and you enter and exit with the biting dog, giving him treats when you enter the room, and ignoring him when you leave.

* Do not yank on the dog's leash or spank him or yell. If you constantly reprimand the dog whenever another dog is present, you will reinforce your dogs negative feelings for other dogs. The dog will learn that when other dogs approach, his owner gets upset, sweats, her heart rate increases, and she shouts and jerks the leash. So the dog gets the wrong idea and thinks he needs to keep other dogs away. He sees another dog and says, "Get away, get away, don't come close! My owner is unreliable around other dogs!"

* That is why it is important to not punish the dog. Instead, teach him acceptable behavior and continually reinforce your role as a leader who he can and must trust.

 

Sorry I forgot about posting this but it was because of using the break sticks in the first place meaning you or who ever posted that was use to dogs getting into fights just my thoughts not trying to get anything started.
I don't need a break stick because my voice stops them and I know better than to leave them alone to get into a fight.

When they are together like that I am there and both are on leash mainly cause where I live we have a leash law.

So the chances of my pit attacking arent as high!
It is my responsiblity to make sure this never happens.

Accidents yes do happen but as a responsible owner I do at all cost to assure this doesn't happen.