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Tail docking and ear clipping

Discussion in 'Dogs - all breeds / types' started by Mix Breed lover, Sep 5, 2004.

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  1. Mix Breed lover

    Mix Breed lover New Member

    I was just wondering. What is the purpose for docking a dogs tail and clipping there ears? I don't have a dog I want to do this to, but I'm curious. Is it purely cosmetic or is there a reason. I think I remember reading an article about some breeds tails being fragile and breaking easily but I can't understand why anyone would clip there ears. I think dogs look so much better with there ears natural. Thanks
  2. 4Dogsihave

    4Dogsihave New Member

    The reason it started out was for working dogs, but mostly these days it is for cosmetic reasons. I am not sure on some dogs having easy breaking tails or not. But it was designed for working dogs that the ears and tails might be injured.
  3. horse_child

    horse_child New Member

    Honestly I don't know. I think it's prolly for cosmetic reason that anything else.
  4. lil96

    lil96 New Member

    someone the other day said the pit bulls( ithink) when (if) they hurt their tails it bugs them and the scratch it so much and don'T leave it alone , then they should have their tails docked, but I think that was docking after a while and tzhat being the purpose, to stop infection, but I have noidea.
  5. GinaH

    GinaH New Member

    Yes, mostly it is cosmetic.
    Some people have personal feelings about cropping/docking being cruel and inhumane. It is cruel and inhumane if its not done right or with care. There is not much pain involved if proper steps are taken to ensure the animals comfort and ward off infection. As far as ear cropping goes if done properly it does nothing either positive or negative to help the dog's ear health. Two of my dogs have their ears cropped one when I adopted her and the other was done by my choice. This topic comes up quite a bit on other discussion forums I am a member of and normally I get many negative responses regarding my dogs ears. The thing is It is okay for people to have an I-don’t-like-cropping/docking opinion but its not OK when they push to get laws passed that makes it so people who want to crop their dogs ears or dock their dogs tails can’t. Some people need to realize It's not okay to verbally attack people who have a difference of opinion on cropping/docking. I say if you aren't a fan of the cropped ear or docked tail, don't crop or dock your dogs ears or tails. Luckily on this forum people are mature enough to voice their opinions in a nonjudgmental polite way. You know I once had a cocker spaniel named Charlie he was a foster anyhow his previous owners never had his tail docked and I swear it is that very reason why he was never adopted. He had this long fluffy tail and yes, he did look a little odd but he was still a beautiful dog and very obedient and loving but yet any time anyone inquired about adopting him they would see his long funny looking tail and would change their minds. I ended up keeping Charlie after I realized a year had gone by and nobody wanted him. Unfortunately at the time we lived in the city and one day while I was working my husband accidentally left the back door open and Charlie ran out into the street and was struck by a car. We had to have him PTS a few days later. I was heart broken for a very long time and I have never forgotten him.
  6. MyBabyShihPoo

    MyBabyShihPoo New Member

    Just to share my opinion since we're talking about this issue:

    I am one of those people who disagrees with ear and tail cropping when done for cosmetic reasons alone (instead of for health reasons). I don't feel as though it is necessary to put a dog through the pain of tail and ear cropping just so he/she can look cosmetically pleasing to the human eye.

    Again, just my humble opinion on the issue! :D
  7. seaecho

    seaecho New Member

    I also disagree strongly with tail docking and ear cropping - most especially ear cropping. After having worked as a vet tech for 12 years (with a vet who specialized in ear cropping) I can safely say I've seen the pain these poor animals go through. If anyone tries to tell you they don't, they haven't worked for a vet. Even tiny 2 day old pups scream loudly for several minutes after having their tails docked. So much for the theory that they don't feel pain at that age! And the ear cropping is just plain cruelty. I'd never, ever subject a dog of mine to that kind of torture. And it doesn't stop after the surgery either. Every taping is agony for the pups. It ought to be outlawed like it is in many other countries!

  8. GinaH

    GinaH New Member

    It just so happens I have seen puppies get their ears cropped a whole litter in fact and they DO NOT scream in pain from it. They are put under anesthesia and when they awaken they are none the wiser that anything has been done to them except for the occasional itch from stitches. As far as taping I wouldn't know about that because I own APBT's and they do not require taping. When Bluebelle had her ears done she was romping and playing an hour later and never once cried or whimpered. She healed up fine and had her stitches removed 7 days later with no problems whatsoever.
    With that said you are entitled to your opinion just as I am entitled to mine. To each his own.
  9. loves-da-pits

    loves-da-pits New Member

    I agree with Gina. If done properly by a Vet, it's all what you want to do. Nobody should force an opinion by law or otherwise.

    Right now I think it's against the law or they're trying to make it law not to declaw cats because it's inhumane. I have two cats (indoor) that are declawed. I mention this on another board and a lot of people thought I was a Sadistic Pig. Neither of my cats were in pain and I had the procedure done at the same time of their neuter.

    I have worked in a Vet's office as a Tech, and todays surgeries are a lot less invasive than they use to be. I assisted in ear crops and tail docks and didn't see any excessive pain.

    I didn't crop my Pit Bull's ears because I like the way they looked natural. But if I did want to have them cropped as pups, I don't want any Animal Activist Group telling me I can't or someone telling me I'm an animal abuser for doing it.

    I respect anyone's opinion for not wanting to do it or wanting to do it.
  10. Mix Breed lover

    Mix Breed lover New Member

    Gina, I agree with you. Everyone is intitled to there own opinion. I think the most important thing is that we all love our dogs. As long as the procedure is done by a vet then I say it's okay. When I was a little girl my Mom bread Shnauzers and she always had there tails done at a couple weeks old. They didn't seem to be in terrible pain. The whole purpose of the topic was because I was curious why it is done. I don't want to encourage any bashing just because we all may not agree on this subject. I would hope we could all give our opinion without all the bull****. We are all fellow dog lovers and that is what matters. I love my dogs as everyone on this board does. I don't agree with everyone but if the world worked that way there wouldn't be so many problems in this world. Just my thoughts. [/quote]
  11. kyles101

    kyles101 New Member

    until my dog starts speaking human and says 'mummy i want to be on extreme makeovers' then id never cosmetically change my dogs appearance. honestly, whats the point? is it for the dogs gain? or is it for the owners gain? we all know the answer to that one. so, why is it important for owners to 'gain' from cosmetically changing their dogs appearence? that question i do not know because id never put an animal through such procedures. so maybe someone else can enlighten me.

    loves da pits im guessing you went to the cat board? they had every right to say whatever they did. it serves no purpose apart from relieving the owner of one of their responsiblities, TRAINING! and how did you know your cats werent in pain? did you ask them and they talked back?

    i dont like it how people 'assume' their pets arent in pain just because they are not being openly vocal about it. they can still be in pain without showing it, they arent stupid. they have brains and nerve endings just like us humans. so if you wouldnt do it to yourself why would you do it to them? is it because they cant turn around and say 'no i dont want to'?
  12. lil96

    lil96 New Member

  13. Jules

    Jules New Member

    Hmmmmmmmm... controversial subject!
    I personally don't agree with any of it, and would never do this volantarily to any dogs I own now or in the future. But, this is just my opinion. I see it as cosmetic surgery for dogs, for the owners asthetical pleasing. I believe in leaving things as mother nature intended.
    Both my dogs (dobe and dobe x rotti) have their dew claws, tails and natural ears. It's just how I got both of them... people always commend me on the street for deciding not to do it... and I am always puzzled at their comments, it had never actually entered my head to do this to my dogs. But if I see a dog without a tail with it's owner, I don't think any less of the owner!
    I love my dogs wagging tails, and my neighbour has a dog with it's tail docked, and he says he would've liked for his dog to still have his tail... and I told him think of it as an advantage, my dogs are always knocking over stuff on the coffee table with their tails!!!
    It's banned over here in Vic, but breeders still do it. I still see advertisements of dogs in papers with docked tails... so they are still doing it. I figure the punishment mustn't be too bad if they are still doing it.
    And if people say they are getting their dogs ears done to prevent infection- tell them to get all their teeth ripped out while they're at it, alot of dogs teeth rot and it'll save them the hassle down the track!
  14. loves-da-pits

    loves-da-pits New Member

    No, it wasn't the cat board. I've never posted there. Obviously I didn't have my cats declawed for cosmetic reasons. And it wasn't because I didn't want to train them. I did it because my Husband is allergic to cats. He's especially allergic to cat scratches. Even though he's allergic to them, he still loves them and wants to interact with them without risk of being scratch. He's also astmatic and uses an inhaler which pretty much takes care of his intolerance to the cat dander. Our cats are very fond of my Husband, too, so if they were able to speak, I'm sure they would have agreed to the sacrifice.

    I won't lie and say their is "zero" pain when an animal goes in for any procedure. Spay, neuter, declaw, crop, and dock. None that have a lasting effect or discomfort. I hate to compare kids and pets, but kind of like circumcision in baby boys. They aren't able to speak, but it's done anyway. I'm sure there's pain involved.

    I've seen each of these procedures done and if done properly, have no radical effect on the heath and well-being of a pet. Even though I chose natural ears for my dogs, I wouldn't scrutinize someone who chose to do so.
  15. asdmom

    asdmom New Member

    i know in the country my breed originated, the ears are cut just about down to the base. it is said that in fighting off predators one bite to the ear can be extremely painful and very distracting to the task at hand. however you will not find them cropped here in the u.s. maybe in the true working dogs but i have yet to see a picture of one here that is cropped. though i have always been attracted to floppy eared dogs, i will state that if i ever owned a doberman the ears and tail would be cropped. in all the other normally cropped breeds they look just fine with long ears. however, the doberman looks plain ridiculous with long ears and a tail. they lose that beautiful, noble appearance with ears and a tail.
    as far as declawing a cat, i have owned 5 cats in my life, 2 currently. 3 out of the 5 have been declawed. never noticed any behavioral changes, chronic pain or any of the problems that fuel arguments against this practice. both declawed and non declawed cats of mine have always been the same.
  16. GinaH

    GinaH New Member

    Man Oh Man I have had this conversation so many times it's not even funny. I have had the same opinion on this matter for the a very long time and no amount of discussing this matter is going to change my mind.
    The part of this discussion that gets to me are the many times I have been told how cruel it is to crop my dogs ears or how my 10 year old declawed cat has been mutilated and no longer a cat. Oh Please! I guess the thing is I have seen REAL CRUELTY to animals over the past eight years I have spent rescuing and fostering. I have seen dogs who have been beat to near death dogs set on fire purposely. I owned one of the most tortured dogs I have ever come across and even after I gave her a loving caring home where she had nothing to fear she still lived everyday of her short life in fear of me the only person who ever truly loved and cared for her. I have seen dogs who have been fought against another dog because it was do or die for them all for the entertainment of man. So please do not tell me the cropping of my dogs ears or claw removal of my cats claws is cruelty until God forbid you have to witness the animal cruelty I have witnessed. I love my animals dearly they are a part of my family I have devoted a huge part of my life caring for them as well as others in need. I believe my animals know they are loved and safe. They will never know hunger or fear they will always have the medical care they need and a roof over their heads.
    Let God be my judge.
  17. elizavixen

    elizavixen New Member

    Since this topic took this turn, I'll give my opinion. I am against it. Like others have said, you have no way of judging how much pain an animal is in. Whether it is a little or a lot of pain doesn't matter. Inflicting pain on an animal you love so much purely for cosmetic reasons is cruelty. I'm not saying it compares to the cruelty of setting an animal on fire, but it is cruelty nonetheless.
  18. nern

    nern New Member

    Thanks for starting this topic Mixedbreedlover. :m14:
    (just kidding :wink: )

    Personally, I would'nt dock or crop an animal and I am strongly against declawing. Its true that many cats are fine after the surgery but I personally know of and from frequenting many cat forums over the years have read about enough negative declaw experiences to never ever consider it. (just clarifying why I feel the way I do, not trying to offend anyone here that has declawed)
    However, I don't think that others that opt to have these procedures done are cruel or love their animals any less than I do. Everything is so controversial these days even feeding, vaccines and neutering.
  19. puggleowner

    puggleowner New Member

    I honestly have mixed feelings on the subject-- however, I do agree with Gina that accusing a caring and responsible pet owner of being cruel to their dog for having their ears/tails altered in a humane, surgical procedure done by a licensed professional is just silly compared to the horrible torture that irresponsible and truely cruel people put animals through everyday. True it is in many cases a cosmetic procedure, but the same can be said for piercing a child's ears, and we don't outlaw that practice.
  20. Jules

    Jules New Member

    I know... I was thinking about how my mum got my ears pierced when I was 5 against my will! I remember being scared and crying! I didn't think about circumcision... good point. It is similar.
    Gina I hope you didn't take offence to my post... I didn't mean any by it. It's just I see ear cropping and tail docking to be purely cosmetic, and would rather people say it's for their looks rather than say it's to prevent infection. You may have not even got offended by that remark, and it wasn't even aimed at you anyway. I won't comment on the declaw thing coz I know next to nothing about cats and the reasons for doing this.

    btw, I think dobes with ears and tails are geeeeoooorrgeous!!!!! Like my little Leela... check her out for yourself...http://www.dogster.com/pet_page.php?i=38975&j=t&PHPSESSID=3966219318ce56a8ba470887eb84dc44 I must admit though she certainly doesn't have that elegant look of the cropped & docked dobes.(If that's waht you're in to) She looks more silly, cheeky and playful. People don't even recognise her as a dobe alot of the time. I'm sure if she was black and tan and had those other things done they'd know straight away. Then they'd probably be scared of her too!
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