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New Chokers 4 my pups Opinions?

Discussion in 'Dogs - all breeds / types' started by lanena322, Apr 11, 2004.

  1. lanena322

    lanena322 New Member

    Hello everyone, today I was browsing through a disount store and found these really nice chokers. They are just like the regular ones except that in the middle it has a name plate. I'd never seen these before so I grabbed 2 one for each pup. They were at a dollar a piece and in erfect condition. I think this was a great bargain.

    I went to the trophy store and got their name engraved for 1.50 each. Just wondering if anyone has any opinions (negative or positive) on these type of chokers? I am not planning on using it as a training tool for Nana since she would hate me for the rest of her life. Maybe I will use it for Laika, but waititng until she gets bigger since I exagerated quite a bit on size. Just using them as a 'decoration'. I do know im not supposed to tie them up with it or leave them unsupervised with it on. Any comments will be well received.

  2. Alabamamom1

    Alabamamom1 New Member

    :) I think the "chokers" are very pretty. Wow...$1 what a deal. I think that they will be nice for necklaces around the house. That is what you are intending them for..no? How cute!
  3. Hi Ianena, What a bargain!!!! I haven't used a choke collar in years, so I don't have any advise about that, just wanted to say what a good deal you made :D

  4. puttin510

    puttin510 New Member

    Those are very nice. The only thing I can think of is that it may pull or break the hair of a long haired dog. What kind of dog's do you have. If they have short hair. Then perfect. I like them. Those will make your dogs look very loved.
  5. lanena322

    lanena322 New Member

    Hello everyone, good thing I havent gotten any negative posts on these type of chokers, id hate to put them away because they werent safe!

    I think I got a very nice bargain too, since at pet shops chokers can go for 3 dollars (a small one) and it has a name plate too!

    puttin510: I have a small mutt and she is short-medium haired, kind of like a wire haired terrier. My other pup Laika is a Golden Retriever but she only 8 weeks old so she hasnt got long hair yet. Ill have to be careful when she starts to grow her adult coat I wouldnt want my girl to lose hair around her neck!

    As for training them with these collars, id have to say definately no for Nana but it is a possibility with Laika. Im not to sure yet, she is a very tough girl to handle, but yesterday I tried it on her and she responded extremely well to it. With her normal colar she will stop sometimes and refuse to budge, but with the choker a slight tightening and she would move quickly.

    BUT before anyone says anything :wink: I know she is too young to be trained with the choker (at least thats what everyone has been telling me).
  6. puttin510

    puttin510 New Member

    As for the dangers of getting hung up on something. I think it could happen with any collar. Just make sure they fit well and don't hand off too much.
  7. lanena322

    lanena322 New Member

    Yep, I have maken sure they fit nicely. I bought Likas a bit too big so I am waiting a while to put it on her. Thanks!
  8. 2pyrs

    2pyrs New Member

    If I am seeing the picture correctly.
    Sorry there is a down side to them at least for me there was. As pups know real problem other then marking up the floor some. The real problem was they broke at the point where the tag attached to the chain. I found one later where the tag was attached on the outside of the chain Over the top of it but it did not work so good, in the end I saved my dog biscuits bar codes and sent for tags and bought a engraver at Sears and did my own. Spent $20.00 on four dogs and have engraver to mark my tools with and DVD,TV ect...Sorry that's just my luck.
  9. bullylove1

    bullylove1 New Member

    Very nice! I am sure they will look wonderful on your dogs. I may just see if my dollar store has some. :lol:

    I personally wouldn't train your dog with a choke collar. I have read many articles on them and they have caused lots of damage to dogs. On the pitbull forum there was just a discussion on prong collars. I have personally never used them, but was told the difference between the two is the prong can only tighten a cetrain distance (that's why fit is so important)while the choke can just keep tightening. I will attach one of the articles on choke collars that I have.

    My moms lab was always walked on a choke and still today has some real trouble breathing because of it.

    Here's the article:
    Choke chains...
    Choke chains have been used on dogs for many years, they are so common that few people give them a second thought.Maybe they could become less common if people were aware that choke chains (apart from being ineffective as training aids), are the cause of many medical conditions including:
    Injured ocular blood vessels
    Tracheal and oesophageal damage
    Severely sprained necks
    Cases of fainting
    Transient foreleg paralysis
    Laryngeal nerve paralysis
    Hind leg ataxia
    When examined for damage caused by choke chains, some dogs have shown misaligned vertibrae and some have sustained permanent nerve damage. One condition called Horner’s syndrome causes nerve damage that results in recurring pain in the eye and severe headaches.People who advocate using choke chains often suggest using them on dogs from a very young age. Using chains on young dogs is highly likely to result in much more severe and long term injuries.For example, agility classes do not allow dogs to begin training until they are one year old. Solely because of the increased risk from traumatic injury.

    Fifty dogs using choke chains were studied in Germany. The dogs were followed for their whole lives and autopsies performed when they died.Forty eight had some form of injury to the neck, trachea, or back. Two were genetic while forty six of the fifty were caused by trauma.

    Pain is the principleThe other problem with choke chains is the training regime that goes with them. Far from preventing pain and injury the primary purpose is to cause it. The general principle is that you ‘snatch’ the chain in order that the dog learns that to disobey brings pain and discomfort. Trainers who advocate choke chains say that once you have inflicted sufficient pain, your dog will learn to respond to just the ‘chink’ of the chain. It is true that in general dogs will respond - by flinching or cowering in anticipation of the pain that usually follows the warning ‘chink’.The National Canine Defence League does not use choke chains and advises new owners not to use choke chains on dogs they adopt.

    Stopping and changing
    Very often we see dogs on choke chains who are damaging themselves by pulling with all their weight and strength - their owners having been told that a choke chain is the answer.In most cases the answer is not to rely on any devices (painful or otherwise), but to understand a dog’s motivation for pulling and how to get them to appreciate this is not what is wanted and will in fact, get them nowhere.Dogs are usually very quick to learn. By repeatedly stopping or changing direction when they pull, then rewarding when they get it right, it is possible to get even the most determined dog to appreciate that pulling will not get them anywhere.

    Never on a puppy
    Never even be tempted to use a chain on a puppy, it simply isn’t necessary. Puppies from 4 weeks to one year willingly learn using very gentle methods. Any force or punishment is simply not necessary. More importantly it interferes with effective communication, making it completely counter-productive.

    Older and bigger dogs
    For dogs that pull heavily, there is a simple device called a Walkrite or Easy Walker. These are simple nylon harnesses that pull back when a dog pulls forward. You would use exactly the same stopping and changing method described earlier, but with the added advantage that a dog finds it difficult to pull against the Walkrite.It is possible for dogs to be taught how to walk quietly without any aids. However, if a dog already has a habit of pulling and is too strong for the owner then we would advocate using a Walkrite harness until the owner feels more confident that they have control.Time and time again we see choke chains failing to help owners. Dogs are very determined, if they have to undergo some discomfort to achieve their goal, they will endure it. Any training that seeks to prevent behaviour by pain or discomfort has the potential to fail, especially when the dog considers it more beneficial to be defiant.Conversely, any training method that provides a reward for an expected behaviour has zero chance of failure because the very persevering attitude that causes the defiant action will be working for us, not against us.There are thousands of trainers who can show more effective ways to teach dogs, that don’t involve force or have the potential to cause painful and debilitating injuries, but an end to the use of choke chains rests with us all.

    I had tried a choke on Harley but she just didn't care. She pulled with all her might and for hours after was choking and gagging. That's when I started to look up side effects of chokes. Thankfully, Harley has no side effects form using one, but, had I continued, she may have suffered immensley.

    Sorry for the long post.
  10. lanena322

    lanena322 New Member

    bullylove1: Thank you for that article, it was quite interesting. I had on one point thought about using a choker on a border collie mix i had, buthad seen on the intrnet that prongs were safer. So I researched and found it to be true.

    Laika has not become a puller (hopefully she wont) which is why I am planning on using the choker. I dont pull on it, just a slight jer so it makes noise, and just enough so she feels it and redirects her attention to me.

    Keeping all this in mind would you still say that it would cause damage? I wouldnt want to use it if it would still cause damage. If Laika were to become a puller ever, I would definately use a harness. My fathers pit bull had been on a choker since she was about 8 months old until she was about 7 years old. And let me tell you that girl would pull no matter what, the choker never had an effect on her and when she got older she would cough real bad.
  11. bullylove1

    bullylove1 New Member

    If she's not a puller, than by all means use it. It shouldn't have that effect on her. The damage is by pressure constantly being put on the throat. Constant pressure doesn't have to mean the whole walk, but each time you are out on a walk having to apply the pressure. After reading about prongs, I do believe they are the better of the two for correction.

    I envy people who can walk their dog right at their side.

    Harley's a puller by nature and she loves it! Its a great work out for her when we walk, and that's why I live by the harness, because i encourage her to pull.

    Have fun on your walks!
  12. 2pyrs

    2pyrs New Member

    I have used a choke for many years and have never had a dog in pain or hurt in any way from it. I take that back I did have a dog one time get stuck on a chain fence hanging there. One has to remember it should come off it is only for training purpose's and should be removed when done. I would take in consideration the dog. As to the prong collar never would happen, it rips the hair out and grabs the skin on some dogs. I take in consideration the breed of dog and type of collar I us with it. I have a male collie and would not us a choke of any kind on him,his neck bones are very high up and protrude out on his neck more them some other breeds.
    Our Jack as I have found with most small dogs like her seem to chough and gag so I use a harness type on her.Pyrs well that is just a joke and waste of money, but has any one considered a leather choke sold by Foster & Smith. I have them on my Pyrs. and they don't mark the hair up and cut it off the neck. I have found over the years most people don't even know how to put a choke on a dog and don't understand how to us it. They seem to feel it is there to refrain the dog,and more horrifying jerking and draging the poor dog around, when it is really there to train the dog letting the dog pull and adjust to the feel of how much it can pull then backing off thinking that it well stop and stay by there side and lessen to what they tell it to do only to have most dogs rebel even more. To each there own.........

  13. lil96

    lil96 New Member

    My obedience trainer said

    Never use choke collars, it only stresses out the dog(for training) and for everyday use a regular collar is better also. If your dog gets trapped in something and tries to pull and pull the collar only becomes tighter. This is why all cat collars these days come with a break away part where if the get stuck the collar just breaks, but on a dog collar if you have a piece that just breaks it is defeating the purpose? but these are cheaper ones and maybe would break if that happens? So I say know it isn't a good idea too dangerous, even if they are pretty!
  14. Jamiya

    Jamiya New Member

    If Laika becomes a puller, I would recommend a Gentle Leader or Halti to train her to stop. Whatever you use is just a tool and the final goal should be to be able to stop using it at some point - otherwise it becomes a crutch. It's a lot of work, but use the halter or collar to TRAIN her to not pull, and then go back to a buckle collar. I am in the process of transitioning Nala back to a flat collar, but it is slow going.

    Another possibility for a puller is a martigale collar. It is like a choker, but it can only close down to a certain size so it won't keep on closing indefinitely like a choker.

  15. lanena322

    lanena322 New Member

    hmmm, i dont think i will be using a chocker at all. they are very pretty so I will just use them for around the house and when we go out, but I am not planning on attaching a collar to a choker any more.

    First of all, while these chokers in my opinion look ver nice, they are inferior (in my opinion) to the regular ones. Right where the name thing is, if the choker goes down to the beginning of that it is difficult to loosen, it tends to stay stuck at that spot.

    Today we went for a short-medium walk, and I tried out the choker on Laika, to see how she would react. Well I will definately say that Laika is a soon to be puller. She was straining to get further ahead so after a little while I took of the choker and attached her leash to her regular collar. I see a harness in her future :)

    When she is bigger I will definately post on tips for using the halter correctly!

    1 more thing: Jamiya (or anyone) since your sister (I think) owns a golden, maybe you would have an idea of adult weight for my girl? I swear, I think she is weighing in at 20-23 pounds at 8 weeks and 3 days. Nana weighs next to nothing next to Laika. But today I will go to the pet shop and get both of their exact weights.

  16. Jamiya

    Jamiya New Member

    Sounds like she is going to be a big girl! I think my sister's Golden weighs about 70-80 pounds full grown. I don't recall exactly.

    I think most dogs will pull on lead unless taught differently. Don't let her pull EVER and it will be easier to train her! A dog can't pull if there is nothing to pull against. When she starts to pull, gently (no pops or jerks) pull back on the leash and then release, so that she stays balanced on her own. You'll have to repeat this over and over again. Use treats by your side to get her to want to stay near you. Change direction - make a game of it - so she learns to watch to see where you are going. If you make it fun, she will think she is playing!

    I am using the TTouch leading method on Bonnie right now, whenever I get the chance. If you have access to the TTouch book and/or video that I recommended before, take a look at it and give it a try. Here's another link to the book: http://www.dogwise.com/itemdetails.cfm?ID=DN193. Or here (they are running a special - buy a book and get 10% off a video): http://www.lindatellingtonjones.com/shopbooks.shtml

    I know you can also get it on amazon.com (and the video, too) but I can't seem to get to amazon today.

  17. puttin510

    puttin510 New Member

    I would use it only for decrative purposes. Like a necklace. I always use a harness.

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